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Angle between 440 dual-snorkels


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#1 sigmfsk

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Posted 18 April 2010 - 07:23 PM

This site:
Krisiesmopes Mopar Stuff: 1974 HP 440 Air Cleaner
says that the orange dual-snorkel air cleaner on a 1974 Dodge 440 police car had a smaller angle between the snorkels than on other orange dual-snorkel air cleaners (shown in attachment pic 1)

> 1974 HP 440 Air Cleaner
> This one is very hard to find. It specifically fits 1974 only 440 in Dodge and Plymouth Cop Cars, + the
> Charger Rallye 440 and The Roadrunner GTX. See how the arms are closer than the standard one.

I suppose it actually only says that a small-angle dual-snorkel fits a 1974 Dodge 440 police car. It doesn't say that ONLY small-angle dual-snorkels came on those police cars, although that seems to be a reasonable interpretation.

It seems the few pics I have of 1974 440 Dodge Monacos have wide-angle dual snorkels. See "king of the hill" (pic 2 and 3), and the "buffalo collection" (pic 4). Please excuse my miniscule picture in pic 4. I did a "save page as" of the whole page to my local drive, but apparently the larger pics were stored on e-bay's server, as they showed up fine on my computer until today and now they can't be found.


Mopar Muscle shows a wide-angle for 1974 big-block HP (pic 5)
Air Cleaner Buyers Guide Big Block Engine Duel Snorkel Photo
but that survey didn't even discuss the two different dual-snorkel air cleaners, so it can probably be ignored as less than authoritative.

Nick's garage shows a small-angle for 1974 440 4-barrel (pic 6)
Nick's Garage - Air Cleaner Identification

I see in this post
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/8170-quick-question.html#post94650
from Huey that

> Dual snorkel air cleaner was used and painted orange in 74, however it is different than the hi
> performance dual snorkle air cleaner used prior to 74.


So it seems we have good sources that both small-angle and wide-angle air cleaners were used on 1974 440 dodge monacos.


Does it seem correct that a 1974 Dodge 440 police car could come with either - and there's no way to know what it came with? The factory just used the old pre-1974 wide-angle air cleaners until they ran out, and then swapped to the 1974 small-angle cleaners?

As an interesting side-note, this site
1971 Dodge Charger 440 -K&N Engineering & Air Cleaner, 1971 Dodge Charger 440 - Dyno Tales, Mopar Muscle article, Performance article

shows that the dual snorkel causes significant air restrictions even for a stock 440 [air restriction causes loss of 10Hp at the rear wheels] but you can get all the air you want, equivalent to the power of an open element by using

> ...the old-timer's trick of flipping the air cleaner lid

your friend in period correct air cleaners that flow a lot of air,
arthur

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#2 sigmfsk

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Posted 02 May 2010 - 06:04 AM

The attached pic shows a narrow-angle dual-snorkel.

I got it from:
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/8452-got-my-4d-6.html#post100228

your friend in resolving the mystery of different snorkel angles,
arthur

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#3 Mr Mercer

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Posted 02 May 2010 - 05:21 PM

I like having an open filter , but I found this dual snorkel locally and was a must have . Seen some on evil-bay as high as $300 and roughly the same price at mopar swap meets . Mine had a little surface rust and worse on the lid , so I swapped my original black lid to orange . Not bad for $90 and it adds to the police car look .

The 440 decal on the orange lid is correct for a 74 , and the one on the cupboard is peeled off my original 75 breather lid . Could be wrong but this is what I seen in the mopar restoration manuals .

I have noticed that the dodge police packages had orange breathers and plymouth cop cars were black .

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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

#4 sigmfsk

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Posted 29 August 2010 - 01:11 AM

Here's some info that I found out about the Monaco 440 police air cleaner bodies.

Special thanks to
boduke:
Krisiesmopes Mopar Stuff: 1974 HP 440 Air Cleaner
nick:
Nick's Garage - Air Cleaner Identification
and mbmopar for the info on his air cleaner housing and cool info on Mopar cop cars in general, and bagman for his CEVS pics


Mopar air cleaner bodies did not have part numbers on them.

Mopar orange air cleaner body = high performance

Mopar orange dual snorkel air cleaner = high performance big block (not necessarily a cop car)
But on the Monaco, the only high performance engine was the 440 cop engine, so on a monaco, an orange dual snorkel air cleaner = cop car

In 1974, the OSAC (orifice spark advance control) was moved from the firewall to the air cleaner body. So a Monaco should show this on the air cleaner body. OSAC was on both USA & Canada cars.

See pic 1 and this reference:
Engine emissions systems - how they work and why

Pics 2,3,4 shows my narrow angle housing, with the OSAC behind the passenger side snorkel. Notice that the measurements listed in the pic do not include the flare. The driver side flare is missing. It must have fallen off (or got pulled off)


We have (2) known cases of a 1974 Monaco cop car with "narrow" angle cleaner:
a) the 1974 440 RCMP car from which mbmopar sourced his air cleaner. See links to his albums here:
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/8452-got-my-4d-6.html#post100274
He has much better pics of a narrow angle air cleaner housing.
b) my car (Marin County Sheriff car)

We have (2) known cases of a 1974 Monaco cop car with "wide" angle cleaner:
a) king-of-the-hill (RCMP- the VIN says it was built in Belvidere, IL - maybe all Monacos - even those destined for Canada - were built here)
b) buffalo collection (CHP-spec fire department car)


I don't know of any 1975+ Monaco cop cars, but from discussion with boduke:
Krisiesmopes Mopar Stuff: 1974 HP 440 Air Cleaner
the narrow-angle air cleaner is more rare than the wide-angle, and he's only seen the narrow angle on 1974 cars. 1975+ were all wide angle.

The 1974 and 1976 parts catalog lists the same PN for police air cleaner:
PN#3830036

Boduke isn't sure, but thinks that the narrow-angle is 3830036, and the wide angle is 3769020.

So the parts catalog says that a 1976 should use the same air cleaner as a 1974, and we think the parts catalog is referring to the narrow angle unit, but nobody knows of a 1975+ that used the narrow unit.

Maybe there was a technical service bulletin that recommended the changeover to the wide arms. Or maybe they ran out of stock, or some factories only had one style (although its strange that one RCMP = narrow, and another RCMP = wide). Buffalo Collection has the large 100 amp alternator & wide angle, but king-of-the-hill also had wide-angle, but with the smaller alternator, so that's not the difference.


I searched the web for 3830036 and 3769020, and the only useful hit I found had both on the same page (pic 5)
Chrysler Muscle Parts Interchange ... - Google Books

Its a google page shot of
Chrysler Muscle Parts Interchange Manual, 1968-1974 by Paul Herd


It shows
3830036 as being for 74 Dodge 440 police car.
and
3769020 as being for 74 Dodge civilian 440 and that POLICE MODEL WILL NOT FIT

But "will not fit" seems strange. 1974 Cop cars came with either housing. Why couldn't a civilian car use either housing?


So the gist is:
1974 440 cop monaco = narrow or wide; don't know why one would have one over the other
1975+ 440 cop monaco = ? Don't have any pics of engine compartments of a 1975+ 440 cop monaco, but nobody's ever seen a narrow angle orange dual snorkel in a 1975+ car. I'm guessing that 1975, at least, used the wide angle orange - with oval flare. I don't know if 1976+ used a wide angle orange with no air duct, or if it used a special housing with an air duct on the driver side.

In this post:
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/7480-bluesmobile-reunion-2010-a-18.html#post115170

Bagman references his CEVS album that has some pics with the caption:
> Monaco that was a restored to a real police car with a 440
(pics 6 and 7) and they shows a black air cleaner with an air duct on the driver side. But I think this is a b-body Monaco (based on what's going on in the engine compartment, such as the shape of the windshield washer reservoir, angle of the battery tray, and cowl area under the wiper arms).

e-bay currently has a 1977 b-body Monaco for sale - an actual police 440, not a replica, and it shows an orange dual snorkel (pic 8 )
Dodge: eBay Motors (item 230517811873 end time Sep-04-10 02:35:35 PDT)

but it looks in rougher shape than the CEVS monaco. Maybe it is a true police car, but that doesn't mean that the air cleaner housing is correct.

Nick has a lot of good air cleaner info:
Nick's Garage - Air Cleaner Identification
He sent pic 9 of an air cleaner from a "440 full size cop car", but he doesn't know the year.

So my guess for 1976+ is that a 440 cop Monaco would have an air cleaner housing like that shown in pic 8 or 9.

And I'd guess wide-angle for 1975.

For bluesmobile (1974) purposes, it seems either a narrow or wide angle orange dual snorkel are fine.

I tried to summarize all the tidbits I learned here. We may never know why a 74 would have one cleaner housing over the other, or why nobody's seen the narrow angle after 74, but who knows! Please add/correct as possible.

your friend in clean air,
arthur

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#5 sigmfsk

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 08:54 PM

pic 1 shows that my driver-side flare is missing - pic from previous post.

pic 2 shows another monaco cop air cleaner housing with a missing driver-side flare - pic from
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/10120-usa-1976-royal-monaco-police-440-maryland.html#post109285

pic 3 shows another monaco cop air cleaner housing with a missing driver-side flare - pic from
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/7655-usa-1975-monaco-volo-bluesmobile-illinois-2.html#post116537

Can these all be coincidences?

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#6 sigmfsk

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 08:02 PM

Here's a larger pic of the micro-sized Buffalo monaco air-cleaner that I included in the original post. I add here for reference. I got it from here:
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/9158-usa-1974-chp-spec-monaco-new-york.html#post103336

The remainder of pics are mbmopar's "narrow angle" air cleaner from
Pictures by mbmopar - Photobucket
from
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/8452-got-my-4d-6.html#post100274

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Edited by sigmfsk, 22 January 2011 - 08:19 PM.
add mbmopar pics


#7 Steam McQueen

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Posted 24 January 2011 - 12:17 AM

I just noticed a couple of dual snorkels for sale on craigslist ...

Quote

In the picture below you will see the two items stacked on top of each other. You can see the difference between the wide and narrow angle.

[IMG2]http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j461/SteamMcQueen/bb280.jpg[/IMG2]

Quote

Asking $180 each or $300 for both.

Mopar 1972 73 74 Dual snorkel air cleaner 4 barrel Wide and Narrow

:BB:

#8 sigmfsk

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Posted 26 January 2011 - 11:05 PM

> I just noticed a couple of dual snorkels for sale on craigslist ...
Nice find, Steam. That seems uber rare to have both types for sale as part of a package.

pic1 = narrow
from
'74 Charger?, 400
An Error Has Occurred!

pic2 = wide
from
'76 Monaco, 440
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/11545-usa-1976-monaco-police-buffalo-ny.html

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#9 sigmfsk

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Posted 04 February 2011 - 01:37 AM

Mr Mercer said:

I have noticed that the dodge police packages had orange breathers and plymouth cop cars were black .

Interesting. pic 1 is from here
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Plymouth-Fury-II-1974-Plymouth-Fury-Montana-Highway-Patrol-Mopar-Police-/250766296073
from here
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/11579-usa-1974-fury-police-montana.html#post120626

It looks the same as the familiar Monaco wide-angle air cleaner. Only black.

your friend in things that are the same, but different,
arthur

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#10 sigmfsk

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Posted 05 February 2011 - 05:30 AM

April 2011 Mopar Muscle, page 103, shows the air cleaner housing / lid in pic 1 with the caption

> ... replaced items like the aftermarket air cleaner and valve covers with factory
> appearing units ...

and I'm guessing instead of meaning
> he replaced the aftermarket "air cleaner"
they really mean
> he replaced the aftermarket "air cleaner housing"

And it seems reasonable to include the air cleaner housing lid as part of the air cleaner housing. But what about that lid?

When they say
> he replaced with "factory appearing" units.
do they mean
> he replaced with a factory air cleaner housing base, and a lid that appears factory, in the sense that it is it the correct color, with correct label, even though it's clearly not factory because the factory never made a lid of such small diameter for such a base because it would defeat the entire intent of the snorkel?

I'm not saying it's bad. I'm just wondering if the factory ever did offer such a small lid? Or is it just an interesting modification made by the owner?

your friend in orange dodge air cleaners,
arthur

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#11 sigmfsk

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Posted 11 February 2011 - 08:46 AM

Here's another pic of a "narrow" from
The Mopar (Chrysler, Dodge, Plymouth) B series V8 engines: 350, 361, 383, and 400

And here's a "wide" for sale (like mine, missing a flare)
Dodge Mopar Dual Snorkel Air Cleaner 383/440 - eBay (item 200574527052 end time Feb-15-11 16:56:35 PST)

your friend in both kinds of music: country and western
and both kinds of bluesmobile-a-riffic air cleaner housings: narrow and wide
arthur

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#12 sigmfsk

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 10:24 AM

It's been over a year since this thread started. So let's update, as we have (slightly) more data to go on.

I'm going on the assessment:
> Mopar orange air cleaner body = high performance
>
> Mopar orange dual snorkel air cleaner = high performance big block (not necessarily a
> cop car)
>
> But on the Monaco, the only high performance engine was the 440 cop engine, so on
> a monaco, an orange dual snorkel air cleaner = cop car

And I'm going to update the last sentence to:
> But on the Monaco, the only high performance engine was the 440 cop engine
> [available in 1974-1976], so on a monaco, an orange dual snorkel air cleaner =
> [1974 - 1976] cop car

Without the lean-burn attachment, there are two orange dual-snorkel air cleaner housings:

pic 1: narrow angle : 1974 RCMP
mbmopar's
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10047-angle-between-440-dual-snorkels.html#post120243

pic 2: narrow angle : 1974 Marin County (Marin County sheriff piggback CHP order)

pic 3: wide angle : 1974 King of the Hill (Canadian Monaco Special)
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10047-angle-between-440-dual-snorkels.html#post108513

pic 4: wide angle : 1974 buffalo collection (fire department piggyback CHP spec)
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10047-angle-between-440-dual-snorkels.html#post120243

pic 5: wide angle: 1974 440RULEZ's ex-CHP
from album linked from ceiling mount rear view mirror thread

pic 6: wide angle: 1976 440 Montana HP
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/11545-1976-dodge-monaco-police-new-york.html#post120122

pic 7: wide angle: 1976 440 TX police
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/11749-1976-dodge-monaco-parts-car-maryland.html#post109285

pic 8: shows the difference in angle between the two types, from
Krisiesmopes Mopar Stuff: 1974 HP 440 Air Cleaner

That guy says that's only seen the narrow on 1974, and the wide on 1974 and later year cars. That corresponds with our (admittedly limited) sample set:
narrow = 1974
wide = 1974-1976

We're pretty sure that the part numbers for narrow and wide are
3769020
3830036
but don't now what maps to what (until now).

The parts catalogs for 1974-1976 Dodge 440 motors have the following for the air cleaner housing - part category 14-29-19

1974
hi.perf 3769020
police 3830036

1975
hi.perf, police: 3830036

1976
4 bbl. eng: 3769004
police: 3830036
w/dual snorkel 4bbl h./perf: 3830036
w/o lean burn pkg 4bbl: 3769004
w/lean burn pkg: 4027545

So 3769020 is only for 1974, while 3830036 is for 1974-1976. I think that's sufficient data to map
narrow = 1974 only = 3769004
wide = 1974-1976 = 3830036

What about 1977?
pic 9: The parts catalog goes crazy, with air cleaners for export, high altitude, with and without lean burn, and none list high performance, police, or have a part number that starts with a "3".

From looking at the parts catalogs, 1976 and 1977 Monacos all came with a cast crankshaft (unlike 1974-1975 which came with a forged crank for 440 high performance models).
Here's a link about 1977
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/9158-1974-dodge-monaco-police-new-york-2.html#post124563
and it looks like 1976s were also all cast (from looking at parts catalogs). 74 and 75 catalogs show forged crank as an option.

The 1977 parts catalog shows Dodge police specific options, like power steering gear, sway bars, and shocks, but nothing for the engine.

So 1977 had no "police" engine options, couldn't come with a forged crank, has no air cleaner housing options listing "high performance" or "police", and didn't have either the narrow or side standard orange dual-snorkel air cleaner part numbers listed, I'm going to go out on a limb and state:
A 1977 monaco never came with an orange dual-snorkel air cleaner.

For 76-77 cop cars, we have the 2 1976 wide-angle orange dual snorkel air cleaner cars referenced earlier.
And pic 10: from
Nick's Garage - Air Cleaner Identification
from
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10047-angle-between-440-dual-snorkels.html#post115274
which is described as
> 1976-77 440 4-Barrel wide angle with fresh air hose. Most likely for full size cop cars.

and pic 11: Lord Vadus' 1977 Monaco police 440 from
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/12044-new-zealand-1976-monaco-bluesmobile-christchurch.html#post126369

Notice that LV's DOES have the lean-burn hanging on the side of the air-cleaner housing, while Nick's does NOT have the lean-burn built-in (and never had it, based on the body being solid and not having the cutouts that mate to the lean-burn unit).

Now we have the $95K 1976 Monaco Brougham:
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/12044-new-zealand-1976-monaco-bluesmobile-christchurch.html#post126361

Even with what little we know, it appears that there's some strangeness going on with this one.

The firewall doesn't have the electronic ignition box, but the air cleaner housing doesn't have the lean-burn control module (and never had it by looking at the right side and seeing that there aren't holes for mating to the lean-burn unit).

And (out of the two) dual-snorkel air cleaner housings we've seen with a driver-side connection for lean burn (LV's and Nick's), neither were orange.

I'm going to go out on another limb and say that the only 74-77 Monaco orange dual-snorkel air cleaners were the narrow and wide units (narrow only available in 74, wide available in 74-76).

your friend in free breathing engines,
arthur

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#13 71NSP

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 06:37 PM

I think back when we were working with the Furys Nebraska had they had to put the wider angle air cleaners on when they used the Leece Neville Alternator, as where it was mounted it was in the way of the right side snorkel

#14 sigmfsk

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 01:39 PM

71NSP said:

I think back when we were working with the Furys Nebraska had they had to put the wider angle air cleaners on when they used the Leece Neville Alternator, as where it was mounted it was in the way of the right side snorkel

71NSP; welcome to the board! May I gather that you worked Nebraska State Patrol? 74-77 c-body Plymouth Fury's?

I think you may have solved the dual snorkel angle mystery!

Theory:
1974 Dodge had two types of orange dual snorkel high performance air cleaner housings.
Narrow could be used on anything EXCEPT with Leece Neville alternator
Wide could be used on anything and MUST used with Leece Neville alternator

We don't know the chronological development order of narrow vs. wide. Maybe they made the narrow unit, planned only to use it, but then added Leece Neville as an option and were forced to develop wide. Or maybe one team developed wide and the Leece Neville alternator team simultaneously developed the other. And at the end they realized they had two different housings.

But, sometime in 1974 they realized that having two types of air cleaner assemblies was silly, and they switched to solely manufacturing the wide angle as it could be used on every configuration. They used the remaining narrow units on non-Leece Neville cars until the supply was exhausted (which was probably 74 model year).

I'll keep an eye out for a 74-77 c-body with Leece Neville alternator setup, and carry my narrow angle housing with me and see how it would look. My guess is that it won't fit too well. Here is an attempt to place a crop of pic of mbmopar's narrow angle housing on top of the fire department monaco (that has the Leece Neville).

I don't have my build sheet, but I received the car with the standard non-Leece Neville alternator (which appears stock), so that fits the theory about me having the narrow angle housing (because narrow angle could only come with non-Leece Neville).

Thanks!
/arthur

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#15 71NSP

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 02:41 PM

If I recall the Leece Neville had another bracket that came off the tab that was on top of the alternator bracket & went back to the center bolts on the intake manifoldthat made it harder to work on the distributor, I had a shop and did a lot of work on the patrol cars around Lincoln, in the mid 70's to mid 80's and had bought a 71, 2-74s & a 75 NSP cars, & parted an old 75 MSP,no A/C with a 400 & the 100 amp alt, one of the draw backs to the LN after they were in normal service was they had a draw on them & would run the battery dead after a few days so we would put a relay between the regulator & the alt to keep them from running down the battery.

#16 sigmfsk

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 07:07 PM

71NSP said:

...with a 400 & the 100 amp alt...

The 400 made me think: I wonder if the alternator bracket for a Leece Neville was different for a B engine (400) vs. RB engine (440).
The Mopar (Chrysler, Dodge, Plymouth) B series V8 engines: 350, 361, 383, and 400

From looking at the 1974 parts catalog, there are different Leece Neville brackets available for big blocks (such as a different bracket for use w/ california emission package), but it looks like 400 and 440 shared the same bracket in many cases.

pic 1 is a Montana 74 fury in the for sale section of the board that was for sale a few months ago. It had a 361 (b engine) in replacement of the original 440 (rb engine), but had a Leece Neville alternator. Although mounted on a 400-style block, I'm guessing the alternator bracket fits a 440 block (although I don't know if the bracket was original to the car). And if doesn't fit a 440, the 440 bracket probably looks similar. And even ignoring the bracket and just looking at the alternator, it certainly seems that a narrow angle air cleaner housing would be a problem. Even if it could physically clear the alternator and A/C compressor, it would be a ridiculously tight fit and look horrible.

71NSP said:

I had a shop and did a lot of work on the patrol cars around Lincoln, in the mid 70's to mid 80's...

That's awesome! First hand knowledge of these older cars is becoming harder to come by; I'm sure you'll be able to help us out with many of our obscure ponderings.

your friend in new members,
arthur

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#17 71NSP

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 09:04 PM

The front brackets were the same on the 400 & the 440 but seeing that photo reminds me that the 440 did have a bracket from that bolt above to the two center bolts on the intake manifold. That unit looks like a standard police unit wih the hi psi switches on the A/C and the washer tank on the left w/ the low fluid wires they mounted the tank on the right for an underhood siren, I wonder how many guys have 2 piece speedo cables for vascar, this unit doesn't look like it has a trans cooler, the 75 Nebr cars added an oil cooler, P/S cooler, the heavy weight on most of the A/C clutches & low gear block out, over the 74s & went to a 400 in 76 with the same equipment the 75s had and a few had a A/C cut off that had a sensor in the lower speedo cable with a control box mounted on the right side inner fender that would turn the compressor out @ high speed& the best way to get a little more out of the 400 was to use the carb jets from the 75 440 that ended up being smaller than the 400s, then in 77 they went to the b body fury, have some broad cast sheets from 69,71 73,74 & 75 I will try to scan & post them, on the spare tire mounting my guess would be that they mounted it on the right side for weight distribution, especially on the ones with an open rear end, ie like the super stock with the battery in about the same spot, or they needed the space under the package shelf for some special equip or both.

#18 sigmfsk

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 04:58 PM

71NSP said:

The front brackets were the same on the 400 & the 440 but seeing that photo reminds me that the 440 did have a bracket from that bolt above to the two center bolts on the intake manifold.

Ahhh, something exactly like the bracket in pic 1? It's a pic of the fire department 74 CHP-spec monaco listed earlier.

I label some things in pic 2. When you say
> ...the 440 did have a bracket...
are you saying specifically that:
> 440s had the bracket and 400s didn't

or are you saying

> For sure a 440 had the bracket. This Montana car you showed me originally came
> with a 440, and the motor now is a 400-style. Either the 440 bracket wouldn't fit
> on the 400 motor, and this car shows no bracket, as a 400 would come from
> the factory. Or maybe the 440 bracket would fit a 400, and this car is incorrect
> not showing the bracket. I'm not sure on a 400, but I do know that the 440 had
> the bracket.

Looking at pic 2, I think I can see why the dual snorkel had the recess at the front - for the A/C line to clear. pics 3 and 4 are of my 1976 parts car with a 400. This doesn't have the significant recess in the air cleaner housing. It looks like the Buffalo monaco has an extra bracket for the A/C compressor. Maybe that uses up some space.

Did I label the high PSI switch correctly? Was it part of a circuit that disconnected power to the A/C in the event of high PSI and full throttle operation (or something like that)?

Do you know what the brown device is on the firewall? I've seen it only on 3 cars, all ex-police cars. My 1974 Marin County, this CHP spec, and 440RULEZs ex-CHP. I list it as "mystery part C" here:
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10252-electrical-things-engine-compartment.html#post110905

> ...the washer tank on the left w/ the low fluid wires they mounted the tank on the
> right for an underhood siren...

Did the factory mount the reservoir on the passenger side (to make room for the siren) for anybody other than the CHP? I post here some pics of siren/mounting
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10404-washer-reservoir-spare-tire-mount-locations.html#post125886
but my guess was that only CHP spec cars would have the passenger side reservoir siren mounting (since it doesn't appear to be a "fender tag" option available to everyone).

> ...the 75s had and a few had a A/C cut off that had a sensor in the lower speedo
> cable with a control box mounted on the right side inner fender that would turn
> the compressor out @ high speed...

Ahh, that's interesting. Maybe that's what I was thinking about with the high PSI switch. Maybe the high PSI switch simply disconnected power to the A/C regardless of load or RPM or speed (although the design may have indirectly measured high RPM because high PSI would typically mean high RPM).

> ...on the spare tire mounting my guess would be that they mounted it on the right
> side for weight distribution, especially on the ones with an open rear end, ie like
> the super stock with the battery in about the same spot, or they needed the
> space under the package shelf for some special equip or both...

From what I can tell, only CHP spec cars came with the spare tire mounting on the right rear (instead of the normal civilian left front) trunk mounting position. My car had a board mounted up in the regular spare tire position - believed to have been used to mount the radio or other electronic equipment.
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles/10217-theres-new-marin-county-sheriff-town-2.html#post115369

In that post TK826 had the good thought that the CHP position simply allowed easier access to the tire, because its a real pain to get to it in the standard civilian position. And moving the tire to the right instead of left helps with traction, as you mentioned.

So thoughts on alternate spare tire location (CHP cars only - but let me know if its otherwise):
- rear location allows mounting of electronic equipment up and out-of-the-way
- rear location allows easier access to tire
- right location provides for better traction

your friend in saying thanks to helping solve all kinds of mysteries,
arthur

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#19 71NSP

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 05:52 PM

The 440 bracket wouldn't fit a 400, i don't know if a 400 ever used the upper bracket, the little brown box with the three wires is a EGR time delay module, as far as the spare when was the last time you saw a cop changing a tire, hope this helps

#20 sigmfsk

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 06:45 PM

71NSP said:

...the little brown box with the three wires is a EGR time delay module...

Wowsers, thanks!

We had discussion here
http://www.bluesbrotherscentral.com/forum/bluesmobiles-sale/11817-1975-dodge-monaco-4-dr-sedan-maryland-2.html#post123213

about the device in pic 1. We mapped it to an EGR time delay module. I just now checked the parts catalogs and see:

74 dodge
3755800 : 360, 440 std eng w./calif. emission pkg
3874010 : 318, 440 h/perf eng. w/ calif. emission pkg

75 & 76 dodge
3874300 : 318, 360, 400, 440
3874310 : canada 318

The 77 catalog is in a different format than 74-76, so it wasn't immediately obvious what cars used what, although many used 3874300.

So 1974 model year has unique EGR time delay modules (different from anything used on 75 and up).
And it looks like in 1974, the only cars with an EGR module were cars with california emission pkg:
A california 318 and police 440 got the 3874010 (my little brown box).
A california 360 and civilian 440 got the 3755800.

I wondered why a california 400 wouldn't have an egr time delay module, but I see that a california 400 did not exist (a california car couldn't be selected with a 400 motor - pic 2).

So not only did you explain what the brown box is, we now know the part number, and why its so rare. I thought maybe I could get rich selling mine to that guy in New Zealand so he could up the price on his Monaco to $105K, but I see that 3874010, 1974 EGR TIME DELAY CONTROL, is available here:
http://www.arizonaparts.com/partlist.txt
for $25.00.

So I'm not rich, but I'm excited to know exactly what it is.
thanks,
arthur

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