8 replies to this topic

[Georgia Biker]

This is the main reason I wanted to join this forum and be around expierenced harp players.

We have 8 band members - Lead Guitar, Rhythm Guitar (me ), Bass, Keyboard, Drummer, Harp, Vocalist, and Sound Engineer.

We play about 50% Blues ( Delbert McClinton, BB King, SRV, Muddy, etc) and the rest is a mixture of Southern Rock, R & B, and Oldies.

All songs do not have harmonica parts - agreed.

To what extent and what method ( if any ) do you use to fit harmonica parts in the songs?

How much should the harmonica player be playing?

I would appreciate your comments.......

[ChAnOoD_bLuEs]

I think the good thing about covers is that you can change things (except if you´re trying to make a version based 100% in the original). For example, The Blues Brothers put harmonica in Everybody Needs Somebody To Love, but the original (or Wilson Pickett´s version) didn´t have it.

It´s just making it good, having fun and those kind of things. The harmonica player doesn´t need to play solos all the time, he can do some rhythm parts in some songs with or without solos, etc...

[Dauber]

Also -- a lot of horn parts can make good harp parts!

Cases in point...three guys in my blues harp class did an arrangement of "Mohair Sam" in which two of the guys did the horn parts on their harps (including a chromatic); from what I understand, at our harmonica recital (which I didn't attend) they actually added some choreography to go with it! Also, another guy in the class did a group participation thing with "Last Night" in which we all played the sax parts on our C harps....

[Elwood565b]

Dauber and Chanood both make excellent points. when it comes to playing horn parts with the harp, the band War (famous for "lowrider" and "why cant we be friends") is one band that always comes to mind to me. most all their songs have harmonica playing on them, but not all have solos. the harp player is playing along with the horns for the most part. in a lot of their songs, you have to listen closely to differentiate between the harp and the horns.

you mentioned you do a lot of southern rock, and one tune that i do is "one way out" by the allman brothers, which did not have any harp playing in it, but is a great song for harp...or at least i think so. on this tune, i figured out the rhythm guitar lick to it and will play that when im not singing. knowing the rhythm lick makes it even easier to transition into a nice little solo sometime during the song as well.

i also agree that you dont always need to put a solo in for the harp. sometimes playing the harp in the background/rhythm is what is best for the song. for me the most important part of playing the harp is your ear. you can take classes that teach you how to play it, but if you cant feel and hear the music, it will never sound right. let your ear be your guide, especially when it comes to tunes that never had harp on them originally. ive played a lot of jams where ive been thrown in on songs that never had a harp on them, and some songs that never should have harp on them, lol, but if you listen for what feels right to you, you can hardly go wrong.

i know this is all waxing poetic a bit, but i really feel that its true. its how i play, and it hasnt steered me wrong yet....or at least, ive never been booed off stage! lol

-Bob

[Georgia Biker]

Bob-

I think you are leading to my concerns regarding a harp in Cover Music.

My contention, and remember I am not a harp player, is the harp is a "Lead" instrument. The greatest thing a harp can do is a solo or specific parts but, not rhythm since there already is a rhythm guitar and keyboard playing those parts along with a bass.

Our harp player plays all the time it seems, not in all songs but, he is trying to find places to put notes and fills to an extent he never quits playing.

I complain about it a lot.

My opinoin is he should not be playing the same thing the other rhythm players are playing. His stuff should either compliment or mostly not play at all. Sometimes silence is more.

We do a Lynyrd Skynyrd song They Call Me The Breeze. He doesn't play until a solo comes in which we installed - after that the rest of the song he's putting bits and pieces that sound out of place.

Using a harp for horn parts I think is a great idea. Our guy will only play one setup and that's using the famous "Green Bullet". I have challanged him to try other mics to develop some different sounds.

How many variations can you get from a harp?

Thanks

[FatJim]

That's why the majority of guitarists don't get on with harp players, they tread all over their licks, tonally - especially with a bullet mic and tube amp - they are too close.

Lots of harp players play all the time, but just like guitar, the way you play rhythm is different to how you solo. Sounds to me like your guy is a little inexperienced and doesn't know the difference.

Get him to listen to some Muddy Waters: any, it doesn't matter because Muddy only played with the very best harp players. Listen to what guys like Little Walter and Musselwhite do - gentle laid back chord work and gentle two-note warbles for rhythm. Small punctuating licks at the end of vocal lines maybe. When they get their solos they hit hard with blazing, single note, wailing licks. It's a big contrast.

In a rock context, listen to Magic Dick's playing in early J Geils band - same thing, just more energy.

[Dauber]

Heh...guess that's why one of my blues harp instructors said, "Never play during a guitar solo. Ever."

[Georgia Biker]

Fat Jim-

I think you are getting close to the problem. I love this harmonica player like a brother and he is one of the most devoted players in the band. In 9 years of playing he has never missed a gig and I can count on my hand how many pratices he has missed. He lives in Birmingham, AL and the band is in Atlanta.

He has learened a couple good runs on the harp but, he never seems to expand. Taht's my challange I guess is to get him to start looking at other players.

He did study under Boogie McCain out of Gadsen for about a year.

I liked your comment:

"Muddy only played with the very best harp players. Listen to what guys like Little Walter and Musselwhite do - gentle laid back chord work and gentle two-note warbles for rhythm. Small punctuating licks at the end of vocal lines maybe. When they get their solos they hit hard with blazing, single note, wailing licks. It's a big contrast."

Thanks for the information and I think I need to work more on ecourging him to expand and listen to the rest of the band.

[Elwood565b]

FatJim hit it right on the head, harp players and guitar players dont usually see eye to eye, lol.

and i couldnt agree more with Jims advice of having him listen to Muddy Waters, as his harp players really were all of the best. it will really give him a better idea of what he should be doing in songs.

-Bob